Chapters 1 thru 3

Discussing Tolkien's foundations for Middle-earth
Philipa
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Chapters 1 thru 3

Postby Philipa » Thu Apr 10, 2014 8:55 pm

Image
Telperion and Sipion

© Becky Carter-Hitchin



Of the Beginning of Days
Of Aulë and Yavanna
Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor


In this thread we'll discuss the first three chapters of the Quenta Silmarillion.
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Philipa
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Re: Chapters 1 thru 3

Postby Philipa » Sun Apr 13, 2014 10:53 pm

Ladies, are you able to keep reading the book this week? I have some thoughts but didn't want to jump ahead.
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Merry
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Re: Chapters 1 thru 3

Postby Merry » Mon Apr 14, 2014 1:20 am

Jump on ahead, Philipa! I love Yavanna.
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Sing and be glad, all ye children of the West,
for your King shall come again,
and he shall dwell among you
all the days of your life.

Philipa
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Re: Chapters 1 thru 3

Postby Philipa » Mon Apr 14, 2014 4:03 pm

Yes, yes Yavanna plays a big part in the lives of many things on Middle-earth doesn't she?

This discussion between her husband Aule and herself regarding the dwarfes, man and the Quendi utilizing the trees she so loves is powerful. Her mind was on the trees creation and never thought other beings would take them down. And we have our fist glimpse of the Ents.

Manwe speaks:

But in the forest shall walk the Shepherds of the Trees.


I find Aule to be indifferent to Yavanna's worries. He's a bit cold and uncaring and acts like a dwarf. lol
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MICHKA
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Re: Chapters 1 thru 3

Postby MICHKA » Tue Apr 15, 2014 8:30 am

Au commencement des jours on dit que les sages situent la 1ère guerre avant l'achèvement de la création d'Arda( Arda représente la Terre, je pense?) Et plus loin il est écrit que Manwë regretta souvent l'existence des Humains car les Elfes trouvaient qu'ils ressemblaient le plus à Melkor. La liberté accordée aux humains est liée au fait qu'ils n'ont que peu de temps à vivre. C'est une explication à débattre, n'est-ce pas un peu injuste? Les Elfes attachés sentimentalement à la Terre sont en principe immortels et ils envient la mort des humains qui ,semble-t'il à leurs yeux, passent dans un autre monde mystérieux. Comment analysez-vous cela? On lit plus loin que Melkor a confondu la mort avec les ténèbres en jetant son ombre et fait naître la peur,le mal. J'aimerais avoir votre point de vue sur cette 1ère ébauche
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Philipa
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Re: Chapters 1 thru 3

Postby Philipa » Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:27 pm

As I read the text again it was not Manwe who compared men to Melkor but the Elves.

It is true the Elves live on till the end of the world because they are so tied to it. And they don't know what to expect after the world is gone. They probably envy man because when they die they go to an unknown place and that man will have to opportunity to be included into the Second Music of the Ainur. I think I would feel a bit envious at those facts too.

I believe Tolkien was saying Melkor took death and made it something to be feared. That death should be welcomed when the time comes. The "shadow" is the unknowing of where one goes after death. At least that is how I understand it.
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