LoTR - The Appendices

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Philipa
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Re: LoTR - The Appendices

Postby Philipa » Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:42 pm

Lindariel wrote:Philipa, Cirdan gave Narya to Gandalf when Gandalf first arrived in Middle-earth as an Istari. Gandalf landed at Mithlond after the other wizards had already preceeded him, and Cirdan was moved to give him Marya because he sensed something in Gandalf that he did not sense in the other four Wizards. Gandalf had Narya for his entire tenure as a Wizard in Middle-earth, and then took it with him when he sailed back to Valinor with the other Ring-Bearers.


Merry, it wasn't that the Valar thought Gandalf wasn't up to the task -- he doubted himself! The first three Wizards -- Saruman (from Aule's people) and the two Blue Wizards (from Orome's Maiar, I think) -- were volunteers. Then Yavanna chose Radagast because she was concerned for her living things. Finally Varda urged Manwe to send Olorin/Gandalf, because she was privately concerned about Saruman's pride. When Olorin was summoned and offered the task, he expressed doubts that he would be able to go up against Sauron. His humility ultimately made him the ideal candidate!


Perhaps even a Maia / Istari needs a little self confidence builder too?

I wonder... did Radagast and the other unknown Istari ever cross the ocean to the West? Just a speculation, I can't see Radagast leaving the forest and animals he loved.
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Merry
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Re: LoTR - The Appendices

Postby Merry » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:31 pm

An interesting question, Philipa, with no answer outside speculation. But Tolkien describes what's over sea as a 'green land', so maybe there are forests there, too, ones that Radagast also loved.
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Re: LoTR - The Appendices

Postby Lindariel » Wed Mar 19, 2014 3:00 pm

Philipa: I wonder... did Radagast and the other unknown Istari ever cross the ocean to the West? Just a speculation, I can't see Radagast leaving the forest and animals he loved.


Philipa, I found these passages in the chapter on the Istari in Unfinished Tales:

Of the Blue [Wizards] little was known in the West, and they had no names save Ithryn Luin 'the Blue Wizards'; for they passed into the East with Curunir [Saruman], but they never returned, and whether they remained in the East, pursuing there the purposes for which they were sent; or perished; or as some hold were ensnared by Sauron and became his servants, is not now known.


Indeed, of all the Istari, one only remained faithful, and he was the last-comer. For Radagast, the fourth, became enamoured of the many beasts and birds that dwelt in Middle-earth, and forsook Elves and Men, and spent his days among the wild creatures. Thus he got his name (which is in the tongue of Numenor of old, and signifies, it is said "tender of beasts'). And Curunir 'Lan, Saruman the White, fell from his high errand, and becoming proud and impatient and enamoured of power sought to have his own will by force, and to oust Sauron; but he was ensnared by that dark spirit, mightier than he.


So it seems it was indeed Tolkien's intention that out of the five Istari sent to Middle-earth, only Olorin/Gandalf remained faithful in carrying out his mission and returned to the Undying Lands.
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Philipa
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Re: LoTR - The Appendices

Postby Philipa » Wed Mar 19, 2014 8:22 pm

Well I thought you would come through with some kind of answer L. :D

Of the Blue [Wizards] little was known in the West, and they had no names save Ithryn Luin 'the Blue Wizards'; for they passed into the East with Curunir [Saruman], but they never returned, and whether they remained in the East, pursuing there the purposes for which they were sent; or perished; or as some hold were ensnared by Sauron and became his servants, is not now known.


Hmmm, there are stories to be told there. Perhaps an heir of Tolkien will one day take on the stories screaming to be told.
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